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Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

jmiller808 wrote:

jonnythan wrote:

jmiller808 wrote:

  All there has been for communication is "soon".

By the way, this is patently false.

They have told us they are releasing Android 2.1 with updated Sense for the Hero in the first half of this year. That's a lot more than the word "soon."

How is giving a blatenly open ended timeframe of sometime within the next 6 months any different than "soon"?  And then following it up by saying its going to be 2Q10 (which is still the same as their original 1H10) isnt another way to say "soon" either i take it.

Oh and johhythan, ive read a lot of your replies on this particular topic, seems you dont ever really add much to a conversation other than a combatative "THEY SAID 1H10 SO SIT DOWN AND SHUT IT" type of theme.  The number of posts you make only makes you a "bronze expert" in your ability to spew some verbal diareah then click the "Post Message" button.  Try actually adding to a discussion rather than attempt to brow beat other posters with legit inquiries/issues/etc. simply because they dont agree with your decision to just accept that you pay for a device and the provider doesnt care about it.

there tends to be 3 types of people on here, those that understand that issues only tend to get looked at and recognized when its more than just a single person so they post.  then there are those that belittle others that post about something because "its all been posted and said before", then there are those that read the posts understand the persons point of view and make a contribution to the discussion with their views in such a way that may shed a little light into areas that others may not see or know about...which category do you want to fall into?

Out of curiosity, how many companies have you worked for that you  simply rushed and pushed out an update because there was plenty of  whining and complaining that spurred the update?  Or because the company  knew that customers were EXPECTING updates, so they just released an  update that really didn't do anything noteworthy but appease the  consumers?

I  would imagine NONE.

I have actually worked for 2 companies that did this and saw how horribly flawed that mentality is.  I have also worked for one company that would release a new build every 6 months and not do a single bug fix until they lumped all fixes into the next release 6 months later.  Again, saw the pitfalls of that as well.  between that time and my current employer i have worked for a few other development shops that used other various ways of updating software.  currently I am a senior developer with a company that gets it.  We release a new version of our software and start planning/developing the next release.  during the development of the next release we still continue to issue fixes for the current software quite regularly.

The problem is simply this.  HTC has chosen to do 1 giant update and not support the device with its bugs as opposed to doing smaller incremental updates.  It takse the same amount of time to fix the MMS bug in a single update as it does to fix that same bug then sit on it for 6 months until a giant all encompassing release gets pushed out.  In fact doing a giant all encompassing release actually increases the chances of having more bugs being introduced.  What would be better for HTC and Sprint?

1) To release a new phone with all the bells and whistles with no intention to support after release, and have to fight for new customers every time they do?

OR

2) Release a new phone with all the bells and whistles, actually support it, and not have to fight for new customers because current customers know they can depend on that shiny new device not being forgotten after its been release?

#2 is the best route here for 2 reasons.  Current customers wont have to weigh the devices shelf life in their decision to purchase, and existing customers that are happy and not constantly second guessing their decision to purchase said device will bring in more brand spanking new customers than the latest flashy television ad stating how much better sprint is than company x, y, z.

By simply changing the mentality of the way these companies do their development is the ultimate goal.  If they were to decide to even do a small update every other month, they could probably take care of 2 or 3 bugs in that time and get it in the hands of their customers much faster.  If done correctly you take care of the biggest problems in the first patch and what has been accomplished in doing that?  Say 2/3 of your customers are screaming about the MMS bug and you have decided to make that the first incrmental patch update.  With that one update in a smaller timeframe you have reduced the complaints by 2/3.  Not only have you reduced the complaints by fixing the biggest issues, but you will also reduce complaints about the issues that are still on the list to be fixed because your users will see that updates are in fact comming and at what time (every other month schedule)

Before anyone can be given the opportunity to use "if they spend all their time fixing bugs they will never get around to going to 2.1" ill offer this bit of information based on my 10+ years experience in software development.  It takes far less developer resources to fix bugs then it does to originally build the software in the first place.  a development shop could easily rotate resources during their development schedules to have say 1 or 2 developers working on bug fix patches, with all others working on the "next big thing".

Whats the moral to this story?  I guess the message of "take smaller bites to keep yourself from choking" and "consistency in support of a device/software/product is never a bad thing"

You obviously have it all figured out, so why waste any more time programming? You should be seeking out a position as CEO and solve the HTC and Sprint problems single-handedly.

The heart of the issue stems beyond what any of us can see out here- its easy to sit back in our Super Mario Bros. slippers and call the shots from behind our X-box, PS-3 or Wii controllers.

.
Bottom line : regardless, you'll get your update the same as mine and the same as everyone else and HTC and Sprint will continue to do busniess as they do. Truth be told, you, I and the rest of us will continue to be consumers whether we like it or not.

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

HunterA3 wrote:

I think this thread has outlived its usefullness

HunterA3 made the most intelligent post that's come out of this thread - as of late.

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

You obviously have it all figured out, so why waste any more time programming? You should be seeking out a position as CEO and solve the HTC and Sprint problems single-handedly.

The heart of the issue stems beyond what any of us can see out here- its easy to sit back in our Super Mario Bros. slippers and call the shots from behind our X-box, PS-3 or Wii controllers.

.
Bottom line : regardless, you'll get your update the same as mine and the same as everyone else and HTC and Sprint will continue to do busniess as they do. Truth be told, you, I and the rest of us will continue to be consumers whether we like it or not.

You completely missed the whole point of my post.  It wasnt to bash, it wasnt to tear anyone a new one, so my apologies if you took offense to my responding to your "out of curiosity" question.  I just figured since  you were kind enough to ask, i would be oblidged to put your curiosity  at rest and answer.

it was nothing more than a software developers insight to other options of doing things that may or may not have been thought of as well as an explanation of the benefits.  Think of it as a internet version of a stores suggestion box, lots of places have them so why cant hardware/software vendors.  The idea was to offer a suggestion that the admins might find intriguing enough to go to others within the organization and weigh out the possibilities.  Business models change, as do the methods in which products are created.  At some point in time someone brought the suggestion of the assembly line to companes and that suggestion has been adopted in all types of products from PCs to cars, etc.

Im not looking to be the CEO of sprint or HTC, nor am i looking to solve all of their problems (have enough of my own).  but that doesnt mean i cant provide feedback to the company i pay each month for services.

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

jmiller808 wrote:

You obviously have it all figured out, so why waste any more time programming? You should be seeking out a position as CEO and solve the HTC and Sprint problems single-handedly.

The heart of the issue stems beyond what any of us can see out here- its easy to sit back in our Super Mario Bros. slippers and call the shots from behind our X-box, PS-3 or Wii controllers.

.
Bottom line : regardless, you'll get your update the same as mine and the same as everyone else and HTC and Sprint will continue to do busniess as they do. Truth be told, you, I and the rest of us will continue to be consumers whether we like it or not.

You completely missed the whole point of my post.  It wasnt to bash, it wasnt to tear anyone a new one, so my apologies if you took offense to my responding to your "out of curiosity" question.  I just figured since  you were kind enough to ask, i would be oblidged to put your curiosity  at rest and answer.

it was nothing more than a software developers insight to other options of doing things that may or may not have been thought of as well as an explanation of the benefits.  Think of it as a internet version of a stores suggestion box, lots of places have them so why cant hardware/software vendors.  The idea was to offer a suggestion that the admins might find intriguing enough to go to others within the organization and weigh out the possibilities.  Business models change, as do the methods in which products are created.  At some point in time someone brought the suggestion of the assembly line to companes and that suggestion has been adopted in all types of products from PCs to cars, etc.

Im not looking to be the CEO of sprint or HTC, nor am i looking to solve all of their problems (have enough of my own).  but that doesnt mean i cant provide feedback to the company i pay each month for services.

No, I got the point. The point was you wanted to share your resume, experience of 9+ years of programming and your vision for an ideal business model regarding upgrades.  I, along with everyone else that read the last few posts notice it mentioned at least a few times in every post, so I got that.  <insert "Thumbs-Up" here>

I'm secure in my resume, experience and understanding of the way American Business really works- so that I'm okay with that. No offense taken and I hope you do not feel offended.

This is an open forum for communication and discussion, so any time we post we need to be prepared for any type of comment that another may post.  Regardless of our back ground, we are never always right.  So, not everyone will agree with us all the time.  I don't agree with your postings 100%, but also do not think less of you for your views.  I, too am entitled to my opinon, whether or not I pay Sprint for monthly service. I don't expect you to like or am I asking you to like my opinions.

There is certainly nothing wrong with voicing opinions, that is why this is called a community forum. Unfortunately,  I doubt Sprint or HTC would take heed of any posts, suggestions or feedback in here, though - especially considering some of the ridiculous posting that occurs.  That would probably be more effective directed at Sprint and HTC corporate offices, as no one in here has enough clout to get anything done...or we'd have seen action many posts ago that is the direct result of this thread: a 2.1 update.

I admire your tenacity on your  viewpoints and of course, tenacity versus reality is what makes the open community forums the wonderful discussion arena that they are.

One the I have been enlightened on though- If programmers at Sprint and HTC would spend less time day dreaming about their ideal business model, and how they THINK things should be....and spend more time programming and producing results, we'd have seen the update long ago.

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

2 points I have... (other than it's getting ridiculous to see new threads pop up complaining about a date that hasn't been missed and was intentionally vague since they had no clue but wanted a way of saying "we're working on it.)

1.  Whoever said they had the instinct for 2 years.... it has only been out for 1.75, and you made it sound like you've had the hero for at least 3 months, if not since it came out 6 months ago....

2. Jmiller posted that he thought that updates to fix little bugs should have come out periodically.  Here are a few things on that:

a) what if those bugs were inherent in 1.5 (not supposed to be cdma compatible), and the only way to get rid of a large chunk of them IS to update completely.  And then other little bugs, which may have been fixable cause the delay of a greater number of larger bugs being fixed. (not to mention access to more apps).

some people say go to 1.6 to get rid of the 1.5 bugs and open things up, but it sounds to me like that is a huge jump in the first place, and so to continue on to 2.1 is not much more work than just jumping to 1.6 (think about it, a lot of apps work on 2.1 AND 1.6, but don't on 1.5, so 1.6 and 2.1 must be somewhat similar).

also, all those little bugs that need fixing, it's surprising developers at xda weren't creating 1.5 fixes to get rid of those bugs if they were that fixable in 1.5.  Or maybe they are in COMPLETE agreement in sprint... easier/better to update to 2.1 and have the whole update to where the phone should be. granted i will admit I have no clue how this argument is affected by sprint/htc holding information from them as they complain, but I would think that they coulda stripped 1.5 from another device (or the hero itself) to do a bug-fix rom.

Also, to clear up some misconception, HTC hasn't even released it completely to all Heroes in the rest of the world.  How could sprint have released it before that, when sprints is the adapted one, the one that needed cdma support.  On top of that, if it hasn't even been released to those, sprint probably only has a temporary build that isn't complete so that they can start testing,  they will probably require that final build from HTC so they can run their testing, which probably they won't get until a bit before the release to heroes worldwide (please prove me wrong on this).

Not to mention people get mixed up in what all sprint would have to test.  (I HAVE NO CLUE WHAT ALL THEY HAVE TO TEST, THIS IS PURELY SPECULATION)  yes their apps, but also they have to make sure it works in all scenarios based on their cdma network and anywhere it would roam.  They need to test if its compatible with a lot of things in their network, (i dunno, maybe different types of towers... things like that I would assume), otherwise maybe it would work fine for billy-bob in kentucky, but not .5 million sprint customers in NYC.

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

@Sainthooligan, jmiller808: This is an open forum for communication and discussion, so any time we  post we need to be prepared for any type of comment that another may  post.  Regardless of our back ground, we are never always right.  So,  not everyone will agree with us all the time.  I don't agree with your  postings 100%, but also do not think less of you for your views.  I, too  am entitled to my opinon, whether or not I pay Sprint for monthly  service. I don't expect you to like or am I asking you to like my  opinions.

This is true. However, there are a few trolls on these forums, so-called experts, and there are also a few people who just love to throw in really obvious general notions while poking at your opinion (you know who you are). I mean, almost 800+ posts already (trust me, jmiller808 already got poked by him/her with some blunt response that doesn't contribute to the thread)? I tried to not take it personally then I saw this person's previous postings that date as far back as 2008 and basically doing the same thing: jabbing at people's opinion or post and whenever you get his/her attention, he'll jab back at more. Drawing attention. That's just why I just ignore people like that from now on.

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

vespa5 wrote:

@Sainthooligan, jmiller808: This is an open forum for communication and discussion, so any time we  post we need to be prepared for any type of comment that another may  post.  Regardless of our back ground, we are never always right.  So,  not everyone will agree with us all the time.  I don't agree with your  postings 100%, but also do not think less of you for your views.  I, too  am entitled to my opinon, whether or not I pay Sprint for monthly  service. I don't expect you to like or am I asking you to like my  opinions.

This is true. However, there are a few trolls on these forums, so-called experts, and there are also a few people who just love to throw in really obvious general notions while poking at your opinion (you know who you are). I mean, almost 800+ posts already (trust me, jmiller808 already got poked by him/her with some blunt response that doesn't contribute to the thread)? I tried to not take it personally then I saw this person's previous postings that date as far back as 2008 and basically doing the same thing: jabbing at people's opinion or post and whenever you get his/her attention, he'll jab back at more. Drawing attention. That's just why I just ignore people like that from now on.

So, reading between the lines- you are saying you are a troll and have finally made the decision to come out of the troll closet? (sorry, I fell asleep during the second half of the post).

Just kidding...sheeesh...everyone needs to relax a little before they hurt themselves.

....And thank you all for playing!  We have a wonderful parting gift for you:  2.1 for the Hero, it will be here shortly and when it arrives, you'll know.  😜

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

Sainthooligan wrote:

So, reading between the lines- you are saying you are a troll and  have finally made the decision to come out of the troll closet? (sorry, I  fell asleep during the second half of the post).

Just  kidding...sheeesh...everyone needs to relax a little before they hurt  themselves.

Ha ha. No, the "troll" or "jabber" is the one who posted 800+ posts so far. He/she takes a jab at everyone. He/she is probably going to jab at me again.  It's good to know that I'm renting a part of someone's headspace for free (lol). It's nice to be thought about (regardless if it's negatively or positively).

On a serious note, I've accepted the fact that this 2.1 update will come when it comes. I peruse this forum for entertainment value and drama. How easy I forget how insanely expensive Verizon's contracts were that provided LESS services for MORE money.  How easily I forget. 😞

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

Yep, rooting is the only way you will be getting 2.1 today.....and probably before June. Trust me, it is worth it. Been running 2.1 for quite a while and with Flipz newest version on XDA, it is as good as a final release. Yes....much better than 1.5 in every way imaginable.

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

vespa5 wrote:

On a serious note, I've accepted the fact that this 2.1 update will come when it comes. I peruse this forum for entertainment value and drama. How easy I forget how insanely expensive Verizon's contracts were that provided LESS services for MORE money.  How easily I forget. 😞

Speaking of Verizon. I just wanted to compare Sprint's pricing to theirs so I went to their site and priced it out. I have a 2 phone family plan. Holy crap! With the corporate e-mail data packages (since we use ActiveSync with exchange we can't use the personal plan), it's $280 a month at Verizon! We pay $130 with Sprint. That's a HUGE difference!

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

Does Verizon at least "Kiss You" first?  LOL..  Just kidding.  That is exactly why I have been with Sprint for as long as I have.  Not to mention I could call the rest of my family for FREE.  We are all on Sprint and have been for over 10 years.  Saves a bunch of money when you look at that.  Even with the NEW Lower rates that the others are bring out.  They are still as expensive or more then Sprint is.   Gotta love it!

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Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

How do you root the Sprint Hero? Is there a site with step by step instructions and the necessary stuff to get it done for someone like me, non-techie? I'm now willing to take the chance, if I mess it up...just more reason to dump the damn thing and wait for the EVO 4G. I'll have a valid reason to purchase a new phone, something to tell the lady of the house.

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