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Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

at jonnythan

Interesting. The Instinct and the Diamond were released on the same month and year. I was stuck with the Instinct for 2 years straight and I definitely will say I got more than ONE update in those 2 years. I most definitely got text message updates from Sprint to update my phone. Our experiences may differ and I may not post as many posts as you do (577?!?) but thanks for sharing your experience. It's customers like you that justify delays in updates. It's an Android phone and the fact that our outdated firmware limits us what we can purchase/download on the Android Market is a concern for Google, Sprint and HTC (as I peruse less applications available for my phone that require 1.6 or higher).

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

spa5 wrote:

at jonnythan

Interesting. The Instinct and the Diamond were released on the same month and year. I was stuck with the Instinct for 2 years straight and I definitely will say I got more than ONE update in those 2 years. I most definitely got text message updates from Sprint to update my phone. Our experiences may differ and I may not post as many posts as you do (577?!?) but thanks for sharing your experience. It's customers like you that justify delays in updates. It's an Android phone and the fact that our outdated firmware limits us what we can purchase/download on the Android Market is a concern for Google, Sprint and HTC (as I peruse less applications available for my phone that require 1.6 or higher).

First a correction: the Instinct was released in June of 2008 and the Diamond was released in September of 2008. June and September are not the same month.

As far as I can tell, the first update to go live was MR-3 and it went up in September 24, 2008. MR-4 followed in November 2008. MR-5 came out in Februrary 2009. They were on MR-7 in September of last year and that appears to be the latest available update.

5 updates in 22 months is not one per month unless you count the occasional minor TV update or whatever, in which case there have been a few more.

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

Here is a perfect example of good software development and update practices for supporting phones for their customers.  Palm has had an outstanding track record in this department and i would love to see Sprint lean a little more weight on HTC to get bugs fixed in a more timely manner and get out of the release and forget mentality.  Here is Palm's update history for the Pre

1.0.2 June 5, 2009
1.0.3 June 19, 2009
1.0.4 June 29, 2009
1.1.0 July, 23 2009
1.2.0 September 28, 2009
1.2.1 October 2, 2009
1.3.5 December 28, 2009
1.3.5.1 January 4, 2010
1.4.0 February 26, 2010
1.4.1 March 31, 2010

HTC could learn a few things from Palm in the realm of development management and release management for sure.

Im still waiting to hear anything solid for not only when, but what bugs are they actually fixing.  All there has been for communication is "soon".  nothing that states what is being addressed, and as far as we know the mms, dialer and ring lag issues arent even being addressed at all.  If thats the case i will be just as unhappy with 2.1 as i currently am with 1.5...because all it will have done is give me google maps nav (sprint nav works fine for me), and access to new market apps (that i probably wont use anyway).  let me be able to receive my pic messages and actually dial a phone number without having to backspace dial a couple digits, backspace some more and i would be happy

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

jmiller808 wrote:

Here is a perfect example of good software development and update practices for supporting phones for their customers.  Palm has had an outstanding track record in this department and i would love to see Sprint lean a little more weight on HTC to get bugs fixed in a more timely manner and get out of the release and forget mentality.  Here is Palm's update history for the Pre

1.0.2 June 5, 2009
1.0.3 June 19, 2009
1.0.4 June 29, 2009
1.1.0 July, 23 2009
1.2.0 September 28, 2009
1.2.1 October 2, 2009
1.3.5 December 28, 2009
1.3.5.1 January 4, 2010
1.4.0 February 26, 2010
1.4.1 March 31, 2010

HTC could learn a few things from Palm in the realm of development management and release management for sure.

Im still waiting to hear anything solid for not only when, but what bugs are they actually fixing.  All there has been for communication is "soon".  nothing that states what is being addressed, and as far as we know the mms, dialer and ring lag issues arent even being addressed at all.  If thats the case i will be just as unhappy with 2.1 as i currently am with 1.5...because all it will have done is give me google maps nav (sprint nav works fine for me), and access to new market apps (that i probably wont use anyway).  let me be able to receive my pic messages and actually dial a phone number without having to backspace dial a couple digits, backspace some more and i would be happy

The thing is that Palm has very, very few devices to support (1, 2, or 4 depending on how you count) and June of 2009 was the very first release of their new OS. Yes, Palm has been very good, but Palm develops the whole OS and hardware top to bottom, only has a couple of devices to support, and had the "benefit" of a 1.0 software release so the pace of development has been very rapid. Releases for the Hero are a combination of Google, HTC, and Sprint.

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

jmiller808 wrote:

  All there has been for communication is "soon".

By the way, this is patently false.

They have told us they are releasing Android 2.1 with updated Sense for the Hero in the first half of this year. That's a lot more than the word "soon."

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

Out of curiosity, how many companies have you worked for that you simply rushed and pushed out an update because there was plenty of whining and complaining that spurred the update?  Or because the company knew that customers were EXPECTING updates, so they just released an update that really didn't do anything noteworthy but appease the consumers?

I would imagine NONE.

So, the demanding and whining and complaining that comes forth from many, often in a rude manner- doesn't necessarily merit just cause for an update, upgrade,patch or fix.

We are not due an update simply because 1.5 "has been out for a while now and other phones have 2.1" or because "1.5 apps are dwindling away".  The apps are from other 3rd party developers so doesn't necessarily fall on Sprint/HTC. Support from 3rd parties is what it is...

Remember Windows Millenium? Same situtation, sure MS had their own support issues with it, but the 3rd parties (for the drivers) didn't provide as much as they could have.

Your stance that the firmware is to fix issues and bugs is well taken. Sure, the updates, patches or fixes should come from a result of known issues.  .

And there should be an update to fix the actual problems and issues.

I'm sure you can agree you would not want to send out updates, patches or fixes that were still very "buggy" and likely to generate more issue than they solve. Of course, to ensure the highest quality update they are going to be tested and brought to the highest level of completion....unless the purpose is to make money off of updates, then its better to release something still buggy and continue to string along the consumers while padding pockets- but that is a whole other issue...

However, I certainly wouldn't want a firmware update every month - nor do I expect one just because the device is capable of it.

It is not very practical  on this particular device(everything is fushed clean and must be set up again) to do so.

If my device required that, I'd switch to another- because that doesn't sound like that device that is ready for primetime anyway.

We should NOT expect an update on the sole premise that we purchased technology that's capable of updates, upgrades or fixes. Of course a clock radio shouldn't need updating- it's perfected in what it does- tells time and plays music.  My Samsung TV can be updated, but it works fine doing what it does- I do not expect an upgrade for that, nor do I think I would if on appears for it.

Bottom line is, if you are considering buying a product that you are expecting updates for- either wait to buy it, choose something else, or be prepared to wait for those updates to be released at the manufacturer or provider's discretion.

We pay a monthly fee for the airtime and carrier services, NOT for upgrades on the phone. If you pay for insurance on the phone, you're still not paying for updates to the phone.  So, maybe I missed something in my contract, but I don't see how the monthly fee applies to any of this.

If the phone is has that many issues that have driven lives to ruin - consider a lawyer for a class action suit, or perhaps the better route would be to take it up with Sprint and see about switching to another already upgraded android device capable of doing exactly what you want it to do.  Otherwise, we all have to wait....some patiently, some impatiently.

Regardless of when the timeframe is mentioned, rumored or released, an update has been promised. For that point, we should expect one because we were told this by Sprint/HTC.  But even then, they reserve the right to can the whole update all together. Is this reality of the situation? Yes.  Is it good business? No.

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

Technical difficulties or not, Sprint is the only carrier without a 2.1 phone and with the Incredible and Nexus One rumored to be landing at Verizon this month, Droid with 2.1 now on Verizon, the N1 already being available on AT&T and T-Mobile, Galaxy S going to AT&T soon, My-Touch Slide going to T-Mobile, etc. Sprint's line up is beginning to look more than a bit antiquated. Time is no longer on their side.

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

"Sprint's line up is beginning to look more than a bit antiquated. Time is no longer on their side"

Because they're taking a couple of weeks more than people wanted to wait for 2.1 update on the Hero?

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

HunterA3 wrote:

Technical difficulties or not, Sprint is the only carrier without a 2.1 phone and with the Incredible and Nexus One rumored to be landing at Verizon this month, Droid with 2.1 now on Verizon, the N1 already being available on AT&T and T-Mobile, Galaxy S going to AT&T soon, My-Touch Slide going to T-Mobile, etc. Sprint's line up is beginning to look more than a bit antiquated. Time is no longer on their side.

The N1 is "available" on AT&T, but not at any AT&T stores and unsubsidized. The N1 is $530 on AT&T.

You could look at it another way: Sprint is one of only two carriers to have a SenseUI phone, and will soon be the only carrier to have a phone with SenseUI and 2.1.

Within a couple of months, Sprint will have the Nexus One, at least one phone with SenseUI and Android 2.1, and the Evo, which is looking like it will be the biggest baddest phone ever.

Calm down. Just be glad you're not with AT&T, where the options are the iPhone or.... well, not much else.

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

miller808 wrote:

Being a software developer for the past 10+ years and having worked for various software companies in that time, i tend to get a little miffed when i see ignorant statements such as this.

jvermillion wrote:

You bought the phone with the software it had on it, and that's that. If you went out and bought a new laptop with Windows 7, knowing that Windows 8 was going to be released in a few months with a ton of awesome new features, you probably wouldn't ***** at the laptop manufacturer for not giving you a free update to Windows 8 at the earliest possible moment, would you? No, you wouldn't.

Where do I begin?  First, if you want to try and play the you paid for it with the software it had at the time card so you have no right to expect anything card...here is where your sorely mistaken...When microsoft releases a new version of windows they dont release it and call it a day.  They release regular updates freely to keep up support, fix bugs, and so on.  After they release the newest version they still, yep you guessed it, continue to release updates for not only the new version, but the previous version as well.  and they continue to do so for quite some time after the previous version has been around (XP was still receiving regular updates even after 8 years, 9 years, etc)

Every software company I have worked for as a developer has done this as well.  If a customer purchases a product, they will continue to receive updates for said product simply because there will always be bugs in software (just some bigger and more apparent than others).  The fact that HTC released the phone on 1.5 and has only issued 2 updates to fix bugs that im aware of. 1 fixed a lot of lag issues, the other fixed pitiful camera and 100% awake battery drain issue.

So going by your stance that we are not entitled to an update is far from the norm in any decent software company.  Even the software i write and sell on the side will get bug fixes when found.

Again by your definition that they are doing us a favor by giving us an update even though they are not obligated is completely destructive to any software companies reputation and would be looked upon closely by new customers.  Why you ask?  Simple, who wants to spend the money on a computer (and yes a smartphone is no different than a computer at this point) that will no longer be supported either as soon as its released or within the first 2-3 months of its release?

Smartphones are not set top dvd players, calculators, or even a clock radio that is not updateable and thus the expectation of updates that fix the frequent bugs are expected.  Especially considering we are also paying a monthly service fee.

Ive said this before, the only thing most of the people on these boards are expecting is to have the issues with the software they purchased to be fixed whether that be releasing fixes to 1.5, or a full on upgrade to 2.1.  Id be fine with it not being 2.1 if they were to actually release timely updates to fix the current issues...MMS not working, dialer lag, ring lag, etc.

To be fair you're mostly arguing a straw man here. The only updates you can argue we're OWED are fixes so that the advertised features of whatever we bought work. No one is arguing that it's completely unreasonable to think that a smart phone would be supported for a period of time. The precedent is there, and it would be bad customer service not to. The only thing people are addressing is the sense of entitlement some people have. "This is the phone I bought, how dare they focus on other customers even a little, what bad customer service that is."

Also, people react to 1.5 like it's Sprint's fault 1.5 happened to be the point at which people stopped the backward compatibility. In hindsight the hero was indeed unfortunately timed. Reacting to that as if the Sprint Psychic department failed us is, at best, unreasonable. 1.6 could just as easily "been forgotten about" when 2.1 came out, and no doubt, soon will.

I too write software for a living, and we do indeed fix bugs for free. We even sometimes give people "better" versions of things down the road for free, but usually only when the upgrade is an imporvement to a shared library or data source. If someone came to us 2 years after their site was developed and said they wanted a new checkout process we did for someone else for free, we'd tell them no.

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

No. Because they often do not get the latest phones first.  Few phones have arrived on Sprint first and often land on other carriers later with additional features not available on the Sprint versions. Then take into consideration that all the other carriers have 2.1 phones and are getting more, Sprint has two options: Get their current line up updated as soon as they can, or swing some major deal to get a 2.1 phone on their network before they loose more customer base to the other carriers. 2.1 updates to their current phones and the EVO will steam that tide, but if the EVO doesn’t come out until mid to late summer, look for more people to move to a carrier that already has the latest 2.1 phones. Until the other carriers began acquiring new 2.1 phones, the playing field was more or less even. Now that we're starting to see new phones arrive however, Sprint's current hand is beginning to look a bit weak in comparison. Let's just hope that WiMAX gives them a long standing advantage over the other carriers, becuase if LTE trumps WiMAX, what ever lead they gain from EVO will evaporate in the blink of an eye.

Message was edited by: HunterA3

Journeyman

Re: Hero Firmware upgrade to 2 or 2.1 - When

HunterA3 wrote:

No. Because they often do not get the latest phones first.  Few phones have arrived on Sprint first and often land on other carriers later with additional features not available on the Sprint versions. Then take into consideration that all the other carriers have 2.1 phones and are getting more, Sprint has two options: Get their current line up updated as soon as they can, or swing some major deal to get a 2.1 phone on their network before they loose more customer base to the other carriers. 2.1 updates to their current phones and the EVO will steam that tide, but if the EVO doesn’t come out until mid to late summer, look for more people to move to a carrier that already has 2.1 phones. Until the other carriers began acquiring new 2.1 phones, the playing field was more or less even. Now that we're starting to see new phones arrive however, Sprint's current hand is beginning to look a bit weak in comparison. Let's just hope that WiMAX gives them a long standing advantage over the other carriers, becuase if LTE trumps WiMAX, what ever lead they gain from EVO will evaporate in the blink of an eye.

Message was edited by: HunterA3

Well, I'll check back with you later in the year and see what carrier you're on..How often to do you get "the latest and greatest" phone?....according to you Sprint is going out of business very soon...

Nice try, but No.

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