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android 2.1 update

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Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

I've noticed the same thing too, but if you routinely shut down running programs, with a program like Advanced Task Killer, you free up any needed memory space and they will only come back when you boot your phone again or manually start them yourself.

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

HunterA3 wrote:

I've noticed the same thing too, but if you routinely shut down running programs, with a program like Advanced Task Killer, you free up any needed memory space and they will only come back when you boot your phone again or manually start them yourself.

I know and routinely do that.

The point trying to be made here is why should I have to jump through hoops to turn off, and keep off apps I don't want.

Then you have people here trying to make this seem like it's me just not liking the radio that my car came with and I'm throwing a fit.

It's not like that at all. Unless the radio made the car go slower when it came on. And it came on every time I start the car or at other times when I do not want. And it secretly came on in silent mode and I had no idea it was on and the only symptom was a slower, sluggish car. And I had to jump through hoops and or use 3rd party parts to make it stop doing that. And if I couldn't change or uninstall it without voiding the warranty, then it would be similar.

Otherwise that argument is ridiculous.

Also, early on Sprint people on here said that we should "not" use task killers...

Message was edited by: jturnbow

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

Well, until the Android dev team works out a similiar solution that Palm acheived and redirect downloads to the SD Card instead of a small directory in the main memory, you have no other choice than to use a task killer and regularly kill background apps. Without them an Android phone would quickly become unusable. Not sure why Sprint reps would recommend not using them unless they were afraid that you would kill a system program and cause stability issues while it reinitialized.

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

Agreed. Though I've heard that the apps aren't "running" so much as there's one small aspect that might load. Like getting a position might use a routine available in the Sprint Nav app, which would make it look as if that app was running.

It is very possible that you would need to download app packs, (you have to have x installed to use y, even if you don't use x explictly) because if one process is done well, you don't want the code repeated. For instance, all the HTC  weather variations should be refering to one weather updating routine. (Which they aren't) So, if they were stand alone there would be a lot of wheel reinventing, and sub optimal, and they would be of bigger file size, which really defeats the purpose.

Google really needs to work on a better task manager thing altogether. The 6 last apps, even if only 1 is running, or 8 are running thing is really kind of dumb. webOs's card system is really slick, and something along those lines should be worked in.

There are lots of times I don't know if I left an app running where you have to go in it and close it, and you aren't sure if you closed a running app, or opened it just to exit it. (Obviously task managers show you what's running, but I stopped using mine after a number of (maybe solved) issues were attributed to task killers.)

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

HunterA3 wrote:

Well, until the Android dev team works out a similiar solution that Palm acheived and redirect downloads to the SD Card instead of a small directory in the main memory, you have no other choice than to use a task killer and regularly kill background apps. Without them an Android phone would quickly become unusable. Not sure why Sprint reps would recommend not using them unless they were afraid that you would kill a system program and cause stability issues while it reinitialized.

See, wait. This is the kind of thing that doesn't make sense to me. I don't use a task killer, I don't routinely close applications, and my phone (since October) has not become unusable, quickly or otherwise.The only thing that has ever made a difference in performance/battery life was replacing the stock messaging with HandCent, which I did before the maintenance release was available.

I'm not sure exactly what problems people are attributing to these Sprint applications, but are they proven problems? And, if so, why don't I have them? My phone is quick, responsive, stable, and otherwise doesn't give me problems. I've force stopped the Sprint applications (through Manage Applications, not an add-on task killer) and I really can't tell any difference in performance than when they're loaded (not launched).

Am I just lucky? Or are people overreacting to what they perceive is bad judgment on the part of Sprint?

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

HunterA3 wrote:

Not sure why Sprint reps would recommend not using them unless they were afraid that you would kill a system program and cause stability issues while it reinitialized.

Actually, that is exactly what they are worried about.  I had to do some serious research to figure out which applications were "system" applications required to make the phone/os run.  However, that is not much different than services in Windows or daemons in *nix.  You mileage may vary.

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

Savage wrote:

I'm not sure exactly what problems people are attributing to these Sprint applications, but are they proven problems? And, if so, why don't I have them? My phone is quick, responsive, stable, and otherwise doesn't give me problems. I've force stopped the Sprint applications (through Manage Applications, not an add-on task killer) and I really can't tell any difference in performance than when they're loaded (not launched).

Am I just lucky? Or are people overreacting to what they perceive is bad judgment on the part of Sprint?

The specific problems that I run into is that I utilize many apps at any given point in time, including:

  1. Google Maps,
  2. Messaging,
  3. Gmail,
  4. Email,
  5. Phone,
  6. Pocket Express News,
  7. Documents To Go professional,
  8. Voice Mail,
  9. Browser,
  10. Google Voice,
  11. Voice Control (a Samsung Moment app),
  12. TweetCaster

And these are just the applications that I'm in and out of all day, not to mention the various applications I need every so often (ConnectBot, Android Scripting Environment, Amazon, Barcode Scanner, Calculator, Camera, Google Talk, Android Market, News Pro (Thomson Reuters), and Zagat).  I may be doing significantly more with my phone (well, I utilize it closer to a handheld computer/communications center), but I see the lag from too many running applications regularly, and every byte of RAM counts.

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

I think task killers are a convenient way to kill tasks that you can do manually through the Android apps manager. Either way, if you shut down the apps that are running in the background, your phone will run fast and smooth. Sprint's cooked-in apps have no more of an effect on performance as any other app I've run on my phone. I just think that some performance and space issues can be totally avoided if the Android app team made better use of the SD card. I realize that Palm has built-in memory, similar to the iphone, but they had a software limited space for app storage and use as well, until the 1.4 update. They've since rewritten how apps are stored in the OS and eliminated the problem with limited space for app storage and execution. I've heard that Android will be doing the same in the near future, only on a SD card of course.

In time, cook-in apps wont be a problem since Sprint has already announced their plan to build their own app store, where nascar, sprint-tv, etc will be available for download and they will no longer be pre-installed on the phone. Personally, I dont care either way, but apparently some people take exception to the practice.

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

I've used some app killers that show you every file on a system, including your system apps. I can see where some people would nuke a system app by mistake. That is why I recommend Advanced Task Killer. It only shows the user initialized applications, not the system files. So, even if it's a baked-in app, it will only kill off running apps and not system files. If the phone really needs the app for proper use, it will reinitialize the program again. This causes some slight performance issues until the app is back up and running again, but I have not experienced any serious problems because if that on my phone.

Message was edited by: HunterA3

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Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

Savage wrote:

HunterA3 wrote:

Well, until the Android dev team works out a similiar solution that Palm acheived and redirect downloads to the SD Card instead of a small directory in the main memory, you have no other choice than to use a task killer and regularly kill background apps. Without them an Android phone would quickly become unusable. Not sure why Sprint reps would recommend not using them unless they were afraid that you would kill a system program and cause stability issues while it reinitialized.

See, wait. This is the kind of thing that doesn't make sense to me. I don't use a task killer, I don't routinely close applications, and my phone (since October) has not become unusable, quickly or otherwise.The only thing that has ever made a difference in performance/battery life was replacing the stock messaging with HandCent, which I did before the maintenance release was available.

I'm not sure exactly what problems people are attributing to these Sprint applications, but are they proven problems? And, if so, why don't I have them? My phone is quick, responsive, stable, and otherwise doesn't give me problems. I've force stopped the Sprint applications (through Manage Applications, not an add-on task killer) and I really can't tell any difference in performance than when they're loaded (not launched).

Am I just lucky? Or are people overreacting to what they perceive is bad judgment on the part of Sprint?

Are you just lucky? Maybe. Or maybe you don't use your phone as much and with as broad a scope as me.

I listed at least 5 Sprint and HTC apps that launch at start or otherwise run without me launching them and without my knowledge or desire. Each one uses no less than 10 MB of RAM, most of them more than 10. So that is at least 50 MB of RAM being used by things I don't want.

Then on top of that add the apps that I do want to run at start and or in the background like Peep, Facebook, GoogleTalk, myspace, Tweetcaster, Calendar, ChompSMS, Astro, digiclock, weather, mail, Call Light and a widget for one or two of these each using at least 10 MB of RAM and a lot of RAM is being used.

Then, add the services that "must" run like Sense, HTCIQAgent, Touch Imput, Clock, Settings, Android System, Dialer, and a couple of com.core things that I have no idea what they are for, all using at least 10 MB of RAM. Some of these only use about 9, but, Dialer uses 17, Sense uses 23 and Android is using 24. This doesn't leave much for performance.

The phone only has 288. So if you are a power user, and I am, that's why I own a smartphone, then performance quickly becomes an issue with the present set up. 50 MB of RAM is a lot when the total is only 288.

Message was edited by: jturnbow

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

jturnbow wrote:

Are you just lucky? Maybe. Or maybe you don't use your phone as much and with as broad a scope as me.

I listed at least 5 Sprint and HTC apps that launch at start or otherwise run without me launching them and without my knowledge or desire. Each one uses no less than 10 MB of RAM, most of them more than 10. So that is at least 50 MB of RAM being used by things I don't want.

Then on top of that add the apps that I do want to run at start and or in the background like Peep, Facebook, GoogleTalk, myspace, Tweetcaster, Calendar, ChompSMS, Astro, digiclock, weather, mail, Call Light and a widget for one or two of these each using at least 10 MB of RAM and a lot of RAM is being used.

Then, add the services that "must" run like Sense, HTCIQAgent, Touch Imput, Clock, Settings, Android System, Dialer, and a couple of com.core things that I have no idea what they are for, all using at least 10 MB of RAM. Some of these only use about 9, but, Dialer uses 17, Sense uses 23 and Android is using 24. This doesn't leave much for performance.

The phone only has 288.

And I thought I was bad with using programs on my phone....

Journeyman

Re: android 2.1 update

Kaze wrote:

jturnbow wrote:

Are you just lucky? Maybe. Or maybe you don't use your phone as much and with as broad a scope as me.

I listed at least 5 Sprint and HTC apps that launch at start or otherwise run without me launching them and without my knowledge or desire. Each one uses no less than 10 MB of RAM, most of them more than 10. So that is at least 50 MB of RAM being used by things I don't want.

Then on top of that add the apps that I do want to run at start and or in the background like Peep, Facebook, GoogleTalk, myspace, Tweetcaster, Calendar, ChompSMS, Astro, digiclock, weather, mail, Call Light and a widget for one or two of these each using at least 10 MB of RAM and a lot of RAM is being used.

Then, add the services that "must" run like Sense, HTCIQAgent, Touch Imput, Clock, Settings, Android System, Dialer, and a couple of com.core things that I have no idea what they are for, all using at least 10 MB of RAM. Some of these only use about 9, but, Dialer uses 17, Sense uses 23 and Android is using 24. This doesn't leave much for performance.

The phone only has 288.

And I thought I was bad with using programs on my phone....

LOL!!! Well I bought a smartphone for a reason...if I just wanted to make calls and send a text or two I'd have gotten a Jitterbug phone...

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