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Anyone else having a problem with GPS lock?

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Journeyman

Anyone else having a problem with GPS lock?

I used Google Navigation and the first time it worked great.  The second time I used it, it kept losing and then re-aquiring the satellite link.  Then today, I had GPS turned off while at work and when I got in the car, I turned it back on.  GPS signal could not be found.  I waited 10 minutes (I was outside, clear sky, no obstructions) and no GPS lock.  I turned GPS off and on severals times and continue to wait with no lock.  Finally, I powered off the phone, turned it back on and went straight to Google Nav.  GPS was acquired in about 5 seconds and maps worked great.

It seems to me that Samsung does not have the GPS issue fully resolved on the Epic.  I was wondering if anyone else had similar issues and/or is there a workaround (other than re-powering the phone).

133 REPLIES 133
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Journeyman

poteen00 wrote:

Could someone point me to the app or function which allows one to tell how many satellites the phone's gps is seeing?

Thanks.

"GPSStatus" in the market is good.

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Journeyman

@ displeased_cust

Wow, that seems like a crazy issue. I have never had a problem with my GPS. I checked the FCC law and it states that for networked based soulutions the location has to be acuate with in 300 meters however GPS-enabled handsets must provide greater accuracies of 50 meters 67% of the time, and 150 meters 95% of the time. I test mine this morning and it is definitly with in those parameters. At one time it said i was on a street over from the street I was on. That was ok though, I just looked up and checked the street sign so I did not get lost.

From what you say you have this issue when in your car. Does you car have windows? I usually stick my phone out the window when I have issues with my GPS and it gets accurate within 10 meters. I think that is about 78 feet of accuracy.

Message was edited by: The_Epic_Rules

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Journeyman

The_Epic_Rules wrote:

From what you say you have this issue when in your car. Does you car have windows? I usually stick my phone out the window when I have issues with my GPS and it gets accurate within 10 meters. I think that is about 78 feet of accuracy.

10 meters is actually 33'.

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Journeyman

The_Epic_Rules wrote:

@ displeased_cust

Wow, that seems like a crazy issue. I have never had a problem with my GPS. I checked the FCC law and it states that for networked based soulutions the location has to be acuate with in 300 meters however GPS-enabled handsets must provide greater accuracies of 50 meters 67% of the time, and 150 meters 95% of the time. I test mine this morning and it is definitly with in those parameters. At one time it said i was on a street over from the street I was on. That was ok though, I just looked up and checked the street sign so I did not get lost.

From what you say you have this issue when in your car. Does you car have windows? I usually stick my phone out the window when I have issues with my GPS and it gets accurate within 10 meters. I think that is about 78 feet of accuracy

Message was edited by: The_Epic_Rules

You have low personal standards.   Being plotted a block away is simply unacceptable.  So is driving around holding your phone out the window.

Just meeting the FCC minimums is pretty irrelevant to what is expected of a modern, high-end smartphone with a GPS that "just works."   You also are confusing accuracy with reliablity. The FCC rules cover general GPS accuracy, not reliability.  The Epic's major GPS bug is one of reliability.

Depending on usage patterns, the Epic's GPS bugs might not occur all the time.  That is because the worst of the bugs depend on a lot of factors, including how recently the GPS was used successfully, and how recently the user rebooted.  These factors can determine whether the user experiences the bug, because the bug is caused by improper refreshing of time-sensitive cached data.  When they do experience the locking bug, users might get a lock 0 percent of the time they actually try.   The FCC rules are really designed to define a minimal standard for 911 servicef for dumb phones.  And as a matter of fact, if a user's phone is in such a state that the cache bug is triggered, and they have a 911 emergency at that time, it would fail the 911 test because it could not get a fix at all.

When that cache bug is not triggered, because of user action or workarounds applied deliberately or by serendipity, the actual accuracy of the Epic is pretty good.

There are, objectively, GPS bugs on the Epic.  If Sprint attempts to hide behind the FCC rules that would be laughable, and unacceptable in the marketplace.

BTW, there also is another GPS bug on the Epic, which consistently misstates its estimated accuracy at 30.0 meters, regardless of reality.

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Journeyman

I just realized that the Supervisor called me on my work phone which was converted to Cisco on my computer so all the calls are recorded.  I adv the tech that I was not sure of the phone number originally because of this.  When talking to the tech that was trying to troubleshoot the issue he needed me on another phone so I went to work which was closer.  When I requested the Supervisor the agent had him call me back at my work number.  If I pull the call, since it was one of the two calls on my line that day, I can get the supevisors name and even upload the call or trim it down to verify what he said about FCC regulations and 911.

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Journeyman

displeased_cust wrote:

I just realized that the Supervisor called me on my work phone which was converted to Cisco on my computer so all the calls are recorded.  I adv the tech that I was not sure of the phone number originally because of this.  When talking to the tech that was trying to troubleshoot the issue he needed me on another phone so I went to work which was closer.  When I requested the Supervisor the agent had him call me back at my work number.  If I pull the call, since it was one of the two calls on my line that day, I can get the supevisors name and even upload the call or trim it down to verify what he said about FCC regulations and 911.

I am not doubting your story.  Sadly, the Sprint management -- or at  least this particular bozo supervisor -- may be trying to hide behind  the FCC rule as the be-all and end-all of the requierment for GPS  accuracy.  That is a total dodge of the issue, a strawman.  The FCC is not the arbiter of all bugs, and this is not a regulatory proceeding.

I don't think anybody is arguing that Sprint or  Samsung is in violation of FCC rules.  We are saying they are selling a  defective product and -- at least so far -- refusing to fix it.  They are, without doubt, aware of the issue.  But classifying it as a "known issue" might allow customers to demand an exchange.  Exchanging for another Epic unit would be pointless, because the GPS bugs exist in every Samsung Epic 4G.

What is required is a firmware fix from Samsung.

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Journeyman

boomerbubba wrote:

.  Exchanging for another Epic unit would be pointless, because the GPS bugs exist in every Samsung Epic 4G.

What is required is a firmware fix from Samsung.

I agree that the bug exists in all the devices, but I have never had a recurrence of the problem since I unchecked "use wireless networks" and I leave the GPS setting to "on" all day.

No battery issues with this setup either, My phone was off the charger from 7am to now (5pm) and I am at 64% battery level.

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Journeyman

@ boomerbubu

You said  "You have low personal standards.   Being plotted a block away is simply unacceptable.  So is driving around holding your phone out the window."  I do not see house you can say I have low standars just becuase I know how to use my phone and the GPS. Just becuase I am a very pertty girl does not mean I am stupid. I have and A+ cirtification and am working on my computer science degree so I would say this pretty girl has high standards. That is why I purchassed what I thought is the best phone. THE EPIC!!  You also say the bug is due to "improper refreshing". Why are you doing that. Just refresh it properly and that will not be a problem.  @ displeased_cust  You said  "I just realized that the Supervisor called me on my work phone which was converted to Cisco on my computer so all the calls are recorded."   What does that even mean. You said that your computer is now your phone? What is a Cisco?   What I do not understand is how you guys get mad becuase your phone does not do every function perfectly. If you need your GPS to be perfect just get a GPS. If you add more and more functions to a device you will get lower and lower efficiency. A phone is not a pretty girl, It can not do eveything well and still look good. It is a phone, It can make a call.

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Journeyman

The_Epic_Rules wrote:

@ boomerbubu

You said  "You have low personal standards.   Being plotted a block away is simply unacceptable.  So is driving around holding your phone out the window."  I do not see house you can say I have low standars just becuase I know how to use my phone and the GPS. Just becuase I am a very pertty girl does not mean I am stupid. I have and A+ cirtification and am working on my computer science degree so I would say this pretty girl has high standards. That is why I purchassed what I thought is the best phone. THE EPIC!!  You also say the bug is due to "improper refreshing". Why are you doing that. Just refresh it properly and that will not be a problem.  @ displeased_cust  You said  "I just realized that the Supervisor called me on my work phone which was converted to Cisco on my computer so all the calls are recorded."   What does that even mean. You said that your computer is now your phone? What is a Cisco?   What I do not understand is how you guys get mad becuase your phone does not do every function perfectly. If you need your GPS to be perfect just get a GPS. If you add more and more functions to a device you will get lower and lower efficiency. A phone is not a pretty girl, It can not do eveything well and still look good. It is a phone, It can make a call.

Not all the quotes you attribute to me are things I said, and I always try to be nice to pretty girls.  But there are some points that need clarifying:

1) The problem with refreshing the GPS cache is that it is supposed to happen right automatically, not manually  That is how it is done on other smartphones where the GPS just works.  The Epic isn't there yet. And Sprint/Samsung seem to be stuck in the denial phase of problem resolution.

2) It is simply not true that a consumer-grade, dedicated GPS should be expected to perform better than a GPS-enabled Android.  Because the Android has the additional benefit of aGPS on a cell network, its satellite locking time should actually be much better.  If both units have internal antennas, the accuracy shoudl be equivalent, as they really use the same kind of GPS chipsets.  And the synergy of the Android computer, with a huge and growing set of integrated GPS-aware applications, makes GPS on the Android much more useful than a dedicated GPS device.  (But the GPS part of the device does have to work.)

2) Yeah, the Android also makes phone calls.  Big deal.  But if all I wanted to do is make phone calls, I wouldn't need a high-end Android.  Any cheap dumbphone would do.

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Journeyman

Regarding Cisco and my work computer.  My work phone no longer uses a traditional phone line.  It goes thru my computer using Cisco IP Communicator developed by Cisco Systems it is basically a Voip technology, if you work with computers Cisco also makes residental and business routers I have 3 of them.  So yes my work computer is my phone.  More info can be seen on their site http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/sw/voicesw/ps5475/index.html here is part of the description from their site:  Cisco IP Communicator is a Windows PC-based softphone application that lets you use your personal computer to make premium voice and video calls. Offering the latest in IP communications technology, it is easy to acquire, deploy, and use.

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Journeyman

I purchased the Epic on 08/31 and drove 50 miles to go to an actual Sprint Store instead of a reseller, since the last phone we got was from a reseller and had a bad experience.  Not only had I contacted Sprint  regarding this phone I also had a friend call since Sprint needed me off the phone to troubleshoot the GPS issue.  They were transferred to Samsung tech support who said there was no known issue regarding the GPS on the Epic and adv me to inform Sprint of same and to exchange the phone.  I went to the store on 09/28 to exchange it and the agent at the store talked me into keeping it stating it was a known issue.  He showed me his and it showed him in the air field across a 6 lane highway.   I had to return the next day on 09/29 to exchange the phone because the radio that controlled the phone portion kept resetting.  I heard the beeps before but could not previously determine what was causing it.   When it reset it would beep which was annoying the 5 times it did it between 1am and 10am.  Also during the times it reset I confirmed I was missing phone calls.   After speaking with the last Supervisor at Sprint regarding the GPS not working I told him that I was willing to change to an EVO or even just turn my Razr V3 back on because the Bluetooth voice commands and phone work fine and I had bought a GPS so then I did not have the need for a smartphone.  I was informed that even though the phone does not meet my expectations and does not work as advertised that it is past 30 days and I cannot get out of the contract without paying $200.  I questioned this because I exchanged the phone on 9/29 and was told that it went from the date I originally bought the phone and that I then only had 1 day to determine if phone was defective and if I would keep the service.

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Journeyman

displeased_cust wrote:

Not only had I contacted Sprint  regarding this phone I also had a friend call since Sprint needed me off the phone to troubleshoot the GPS issue.  They were transferred to Samsung tech support who said there was no known issue regarding the GPS on the Epic and adv me to inform Sprint of same and to exchange the phone. ...  I was informed that even though the phone does not meet my expectations and does not work as advertised that it is past 30 days and I cannot get out of the contract without paying $200. ...

This is why it is necessary to keep this issue front-and-center on the forums.  Samsung and Sprint have adopted an official policy of denial, even though users have established that in fact there are bugs with the Epic GPS.

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