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froyo 2.2 now on epic?

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Journeyman

froyo 2.2 now on epic?

As of yesterday 09/08/10 my sprint store rep.  told me that the epic now has froyo 2.2.  It was too late to go to the store but this guy has been on point with all of my issues throughout  the years and was especially sensitive to my issue with the moment only having 2.1 and not supporting direct headset voice commands.  So, I think I'll stop by the store and check it out for myself. If this is true, sprint might want to update their website information.

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Journeyman

None of that news from the Samsung U.K. subsidiary means squat in the United States.  It pertains only to those markets overseas.

Anyone trying to apply those announcements to U.S. carriers is simply wrong.  That includes the Engadget link upthread.  The Engadget blogger failed to read the press release closely.

This is not just my interpretation.  The Engadget story attempting to stretch these facts to the U.S. markets was debunked all over the Internet yesterday.  By midday, the official Twitter sites for Samsung USA expressly denied that the U.K. announcement applied here, and repeated what Samsung USA has said all along:  Froyo (Android 2.2) will be deployed in the United States sometime this year.  I have never seen any official announcement more specific than that.

As for the "Brighthand.com" site (who the heck is that?  I've never heard of them.)  they were just as wrong as Engadget.

Browse the Samsung Twitter site for Galaxy S phones in the U.S. here:

http://twitter.com/galaxyssupport

All "Galaxy S" phones worldwide are not the same.  There are different companies, different networks. different hardware, different firmwares, different bugs, different development schedules and different deployment schedules.

Those are relevant facts, which cheap blogs such as Engadget ignore.

As for speculation, my own guess is that the Epic will get the upgrades after its siblings and cousins in the Galaxy S family because the hardware is furthest removed from the Samsung Galaxy S reference model introduced first in Europe.  Unlike its European cousin, the Epic is equipped with a CDMA radio, a 4G Wimax radio, and a QWERTY keyboard.  Just making and testing those changes to the reference Froyo firmware from Samsung will probably take time.  That is what happened when the Galaxy S running Android 2.1 was first introduced:  The GSM-based European model was released first in June.  The first GSM-based variants in the United States (the T-Mobile Vibrant and AT&T Captivate) came next in July, and the CDMA/Wimax Epic 4G was released on Aug. 31.

Message was edited by: boomerbubba

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Journeyman

Thanks for sharing the Twitter link and did read there that they don't have a United States release date.  I shared some of the stories just so folks could see what was going on with our line of phones.  Sprint released the Epic, as well as the EVO, as industry leading 4G phones.  Although I am sure Europe enjoys getting the upgrade this is a big snub at the U.S. folks.  I don't mean to sound to snobbish, but realistically shouldn't we get the upgrade here just as fast?  Or at least just the Epic?  The Epic is being touted as I said as a leading phone right now and it should be one that has an industry leading operating system.  I am sure others in this group will back that up.  These phones weren't cheap and it would be nice if they had the functionality, especially the GPS fix and hands-free Bluetooth dialing capability.

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Journeyman

We got two Epics from the Best Buy Mobile store at the Mall of America.

I'm really amazed no one bothered to tell us this when we were looking at phones. No handsfree dialing ??? REALLY????

That, of course, after a battle that lasted days trying to get the batteries to keep working past 3 hours. Once we got beyond that hurdle I really thought we'd won. That is, until I wanted to use our phones safely in heavy traffic.

Rather than be silly about all this I'm going to quietly return these and get something else. I miss my Blackberry!

These things aren't half the phone I thought they were. Maybe we'll look again in a few more years. That are just spring for the Apple iPhone 4 we originally wanted to get.

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Journeyman

RussD wrote:

Thanks for sharing the Twitter link and did read there that they don't have a United States release date.  I shared some of the stories just so folks could see what was going on with our line of phones.  Sprint released the Epic, as well as the EVO, as industry leading 4G phones.  Although I am sure Europe enjoys getting the upgrade this is a big snub at the U.S. folks.  I don't mean to sound to snobbish, but realistically shouldn't we get the upgrade here just as fast?  Or at least just the Epic?  The Epic is being touted as I said as a leading phone right now and it should be one that has an industry leading operating system.  I am sure others in this group will back that up.  These phones weren't cheap and it would be nice if they had the functionality, especially the GPS fix and hands-free Bluetooth dialing capability

I sympathize.  I also would like Froyo (Android 2.2) immediately, and it is frustrating to see the Epic lag behind competitive devices.  I also would like a pony.  Realistically, I don't expect to get a pony at all, and I don't expect to get Froyo until December.  My intent in publishing my comment was to set the record straight on the facts.  The Engadget story upthread, and the last story you posted from that no-name copycat site, were simply wrong on the facts about the actual status of Froyo deployment in the United States market.  Samsung has not announced that it will be in November, but has said it will be by the end of the year.  So I do expect that and plan to hold Sprint accountable for it.

A footnote about your last statement about "the functionality, especially the GPS fix ..."  There are, in fact, GPS bugs on the Epic.  I am pretty knowledgeable about them, having tested the GPS rigorously and helped to isolate those bugs, and I have insisted here that Sprint and Samsung must fix those bugs.  You can see my comments on the GPS threads here.


However, the Epic GPS bugs have nothing to do with Froyo, and there is no reason to expect that the arrival of Froyo will cure them.  I have seen published statements from Samsung that it will include a "GPS fix" with the Froyo release for the European models of the Galaxy S.  But the Epic's GPS bugs are not the same GPS bugs that have plagued those models (the international I9000) or its GSM-based sibilings in the U.S., the Vibrant and Captivate.  (I used to own Vibrants, have tested its GPS rigorously, and continue to follow that status closely.)  Not only are the GPS symptoms different on the Epic, but it does not even use the same GPS chipset or controlling software as the GSM-based models.  Different hardware.  Different software. Different bugs.

So the GPS bug fix and the Froyo enhancement are two entirely separate issues.  They could be bundled together, but that would be coincidental.

Further, as for what Sprint and Samsung have promised Epic owners, they never have said that Froyo will come any sooner than the end of the year.  But even before the Epic was released Aug. 31, Samsung issued a public statement that the GPS on the Epic had been "tested and validated."  So fixing the specific GPS bugs on the Epic is a promise already overdue.

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Journeyman

Technically speaking...  Not defending Samsung or anything...  You are kinda right and kinda wrong...

When you ask the question "Does the Epic have the GPS bug like the other Samsung Galaxy devices?"

Their reply was what you stated.  As you said yourself different hardware, different software, different bugs...  So they did not lie about it.

As above everytime the question was asked was always based on the other Galaxy S devices which you have pointed out they are different scenarios.  They also said that GPS works...  It does work, BUT not the way people want it to work.  There's a difference between usage between users that some people will experience the bug more often than others.

There's a fine line for both scenarios, and I believe personally that Samsung is working on the problem.  People should have returned their devices in the 30 days if they believed it wouldn't be fixed within the 30 days...  That's honestly on the customer as why be stuck with something you will not be happy with?  Why complain about something when you have the opportunity to return it and get something that better suites your needs?  If some things bothered me to the point where I start name calling or bash on someone opinion and views I would have returned my device and find something that works for me.  It's not worth the headache.

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Journeyman

Tidbits808 wrote:

Technically speaking...  Not defending Samsung or anything...  You are kinda right and kinda wrong...

When you ask the question "Does the Epic have the GPS bug like the other Samsung Galaxy devices?"

Their reply was what you stated.  As you said yourself different hardware, different software, different bugs...  So they did not lie about it.

As above everytime the question was asked was always based on the other Galaxy S devices which you have pointed out they are different scenarios.  They also said that GPS works...  It does work, BUT not the way people want it to work.  There's a difference between usage between users that some people will experience the bug more often than others.

There's a fine line for both scenarios, and I believe personally that Samsung is working on the problem.  People should have returned their devices in the 30 days if they believed it wouldn't be fixed within the 30 days...  That's honestly on the customer as why be stuck with something you will not be happy with?  Why complain about something when you have the opportunity to return it and get something that better suites your needs?  If some things bothered me to the point where I start name calling or bash on someone opinion and views I would have returned my device and find something that works for me.  It's not worth the headache.

I really get sick of lame apoligias like that.  The fact is that there are GPS bugs, and Sprint and Samsung have an affirmative obligation to fix them.

Just because they manage to fool enough people for 30 days does not alter that.  The way you describe the game, we consumers are at the mercy of the carriers and manufacturers if only they can obscure their defects during that brief trial period.  We may have little recourse, but we certainly have no need to keep silent if the defects remain.

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Journeyman

I am not an apologist.  I am realistically looking at the situation.  Returning the device during your trial period does MORE than holding onto the device and crying about what it does not get/do.  If it bothered you that much and regardless if they said they are working on the fix.  If you didn't want to wait for it to be fixed return you device.

How did they fool you?  They didn't magically make it work then stop making it work. Everyone knew about the problems and complained about the problems.  Everyone KNEW they said they are working on a fix, and YOU chose to wait for it. That's on YOU.  After going through so many devices from the iPhone to the Nexus One, and now the Epic.  People claim these devices are like a "mini" computer, and if that's the case, bug fixes doesn't always fix the bugs right away.  Sometimes it takes 2+ attempts to fix it to fix it.

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Journeyman

Bubba you're absolutely right, and thank you for the productive input. That trial period is entirely too short. Further more, if you're looking for a phone that is somewhat close to the Evo, but with a keyboard, well, you don't really have any other choice. I cam from the Hero, and I'm just not an "all screen" person. Tidbits, I'm not sure if you're an Epic owner, and if you are, I would be willing to bet that you didn't spend your money on it, judging by the tone of your message. I think this is just entertainment for you, and hey, to each his own. But, the fact remains, Samsung has to do better. This phone has entirely too many bugs for Froyo to be the only thing we are looking forward to. I would like to see at least two updates before Froyo, just to gain confidence that they are working on the issues.

Bubba do you know if they are planning on fixing the call waiting issue?

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Journeyman

Tidbits808 wrote:

I am not an apologist.  I am realistically looking at the situation.  Returning the device during your trial period does MORE than holding onto the device and crying about what it does not get/do.  If it bothered you that much and regardless if they said they are working on the fix.  If you didn't want to wait for it to be fixed return you device.

How did they fool you?  They didn't magically make it work then stop making it work. Everyone knew about the problems and complained about the problems.  Everyone KNEW they said they are working on a fix, and YOU chose to wait for it. That's on YOU.  After going through so many devices from the iPhone to the Nexus One, and now the Epic.  People claim these devices are like a "mini" computer, and if that's the case, bug fixes doesn't always fix the bugs right away.  Sometimes it takes 2+ attempts to fix it to fix it.

Yes, you are an apologist.  You are defending the cynical game that corporate vendors play in this industry against consumers, pushing defective products not worthy of release.  Their objective in the game, which you defend as legitimate, is to use leading edge phones as bait for expensive contractual commitments they offer as take-it-or-leave-it, playing a numbers game of enticing most of the customers to stay on the hook beyond the very limited trial period.

Actually, they did not fool me about the GPS on the Epic.  I happen to be one in ten thousand consumers who spent much time and energy analyzing the particular GPS bugs on this phone and the other Galaxy S variants, in spite of cynically crafted PR by Samsung and the carriers.  (To this day Sprint fails to acknowledge publicly that there are any such bugs.)  I did take a calculated risk that they will step up and fix the bugs in the future.  I also am aware of workarounds for the worst of the bugs, which I daresay most end-users are not.  So I hope for a fix, and I expect a fix -- because despite your rationalization, a fully working GPS is simply basic, core functionality integral to a high-end Android phone.  If the product doesn't meet my reasonable expectations I will continue to say so and make that complaint felt.

If Sprint and Samsung do not fix it, I know that because I did not return the phone and break the contract within 30 days I may have little tangible recourse or remedy.  But one thing I can do in that unfortunate case is to complain publicly in whatever forum is available, including this one.  And when pro-corporate apologists like you intrude and imply that consumers should just bend over and take it because our 30 days are up, I will ignore your silly apologia and continue to publicize the product defects. Because the defects are objective facts, demonstrable in controlled testing.  The GPS on this high-end Android cannot perform as well as most competitive devices.  I don't make irrational or uninformed rants against Samsung or Sprint, as some do.  That makes my complaints more credible -- and more enduring.  Steady, rational complaints will just be my way of warning as many potential Sprint customers as possible about the GPS defects, so other consumers can make their own informed decisions within 30 days -- just as you disengenously say they should.

I hope such a long-term campaign will not be necessary.  All Sprint and Samsung have to do is fix the GPS bugs and all will be well.

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Journeyman

boomerbubba wrote:

Tidbits808 wrote:

I am not an apologist.  I am realistically looking at the situation.  Returning the device during your trial period does MORE than holding onto the device and crying about what it does not get/do.  If it bothered you that much and regardless if they said they are working on the fix.  If you didn't want to wait for it to be fixed return you device.

How did they fool you?  They didn't magically make it work then stop making it work. Everyone knew about the problems and complained about the problems.  Everyone KNEW they said they are working on a fix, and YOU chose to wait for it. That's on YOU.  After going through so many devices from the iPhone to the Nexus One, and now the Epic.  People claim these devices are like a "mini" computer, and if that's the case, bug fixes doesn't always fix the bugs right away.  Sometimes it takes 2+ attempts to fix it to fix it.

Yes, you are an apologist.  You are defending the cynical game that corporate vendors play in this industry against consumers, pushing defective products not worthy of release.  Their objective in the game, which you defend as legitimate, is to use leading edge phones as bait for expensive contractual commitments they offer as take-it-or-leave-it, playing a numbers game of enticing most of the customers to stay on the hook beyond the very limited trial period.

Actually, they did not fool me about the GPS on the Epic.  I happen to be one in ten thousand consumers who spent much time and energy analyzing the particular GPS bugs on this phone and the other Galaxy S variants, in spite of cynically crafted PR by Samsung and the carriers.  (To this day Sprint fails to acknowledge publicly that there are any such bugs.)  I did take a calculated risk that they will step up and fix the bugs in the future.  I also am aware of workarounds for the worst of the bugs, which I daresay most end-users are not.  So I hope for a fix, and I expect a fix -- because despite your rationalization, a fully working GPS is simply basic, core functionality integral to a high-end Android phone.  If the product doesn't meet my reasonable expectations I will continue to say so and make that complaint felt.

If Sprint and Samsung do not fix it, I know that because I did not return the phone and break the contract within 30 days I may have little tangible recourse or remedy.  But one thing I can do in that unfortunate case is to complain publicly in whatever forum is available, including this one.  And when pro-corporate apologists like you intrude and imply that consumers should just bend over and take it because our 30 days are up, I will ignore your silly apologia and continue to publicize the product defects. Because the defects are objective facts, demonstrable in controlled testing.  The GPS on this high-end Android cannot perform as well as most competitive devices.  I don't make irrational or uninformed rants against Samsung or Sprint, as some do.  That makes my complaints more credible -- and more enduring.  Steady, rational complaints will just be my way of warning as many potential Sprint customers as possible about the GPS defects, so other consumers can make their own informed decisions within 30 days -- just as you disengenously say they should.

I hope such a long-term campaign will not be necessary.  All Sprint and Samsung have to do is fix the GPS bugs and all will be well.

You are funny...  I am NOT an apologist as I simply stated it's far GREATER results returning your device than it is to hold on to it and cry about it, or simply not buying it after the reports came out it had problems.  So I am a apologist for telling people to hurt Samsung where it hurts?  Really? If I said something different then what would I be called?  I have seen so many times where someone purchased the device even after they heard about the issues.  This issue if GPS was so important to someone they would find out the problem well within their 30 day window.  Returning their device = no money for Samsung.  Seriously grow up and stop labeling people without thinking things through.

Consumers have given away more power later with impulse buys without serious rational thoughts.  If people were more rational in their purchases there would be a lot better devices out right now with less problems.

Call me what you want, and I hope you enjoy yourself.

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Journeyman

Boomer you're right.  We are customers for longer than the trial period.  Sprint keeps playing the commercials non-stop and I see them every time I have the TV on for the Samsung Epic, one of their "premier" phones and should receive the attention as such.

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Journeyman

Titbits, you ARE an apologist, and your posts excusing/explaining Samusung/Sprint's inaction re various problems, in this case the GPS, are not helpful.  Boomer bubba is right on target, and his posts on the matter are constructive, as in being very informative.

I used the GPS on my Instinct extensively, as it had features that even the latest Garmin lacked, and naturally expected the same results from the Epic, supposedly a more advanced, and certainly more expensive, phone.  I am NOT going to return it and don't consider the fact that the GPS doesn't work to be my fault!  That is a patentlly ridiculous statement.  Please give it up and let's move on, trying to get our phones working the way they were advertised to, and that we have a right to expect them to.

Message was edited by: poteen00

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